Sleep!

Newcomer introductions, personal anecdotes, caregiver issues, lab results, and n=1 experimentation.
Lindajane
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Re: Sleep!

Postby Lindajane » Fri Jul 06, 2018 3:17 pm

I too am 65 and started HRT a few months ago on a very low dose, Biest 1mg: Pro 40mg. I have not taken hormones before. I soon noticed not feeling as peaceful and calm. Maybe less libido. I know my memory is no better. My doctor has just doubled the dosage. How long should I wait to see improvement? I'm not averse to taking them just not wanting to spend money needlessly and surely not if there is no reason. My estradiol was 8.3 and progesterone 0.3 before starting the HRT. I will have labs redone after taking the new dose for a month or so.

Also, has anyone here in their 60s taken HRTs and seen improvement?

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Re: Sleep!

Postby NF52 » Fri Jul 06, 2018 5:15 pm

Lindajane wrote:has anyone here in their 60s taken HRTs and seen improvement?
Hi Lindajane,

HRT is a hot topic (no pun intended) on the forum. Stavia, the physician/author of the Primer, has a section on it there. Here's a link in case you haven't seen it: Oestrogen/estrogen aka HRT (hormone replacement therapy)

Here's a link to a video uploaded to YouTube by ApoE4.Info. In it, "Dr Ann Hathaway, MD discusses Hormone Replacement Therapy as it relates to reversal and remediation of cognitive decline with a special emphasis on studies that accounted for APOE-ε4 status."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAmPO6lde4o

I hope some women with direct experience of HRT in their 60's will share their experiences with you. I'm in that age group, but was exposed to high levels of synthetic estrogen in utero as a "DES daughter", so have to be careful with adding more now, as I already have an increased risk of breast cancer from all that excess exposure.
4/4 and still an optimist!

Lindajane
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Re: Sleep!

Postby Lindajane » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:43 am

Thanks NF52. I've looked at these and read the long thread on HRT. A lot of good information. For me I have to weigh out the possibility of better memory and not feeling as good as before HRT. Hopefully this higher dose will improve how I feel. For those of us who are 10 or more years into menopause it seems the jury is still out.

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Karengo
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Re: Sleep!

Postby Karengo » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:30 am

Welcome to our community Sally & Karina52: We appreciate you joining our community.

You raise some interesting points about bHRT. First off I'll make it clear that I'm not a doctor. The views I share are from a woman with my own perspective on HRT and as user.

I remember years ago there was a news story breakout that raised a lot of questions about the efficacy of HRT and possible links to cancer risks back in the early 2000s. It was very controversial and caused quite a stir. I also remember that a lot of women (my mum was one of them) were advised by their doctors to immediately stop using HRT which had a lot of impacts on their general health and well being. You can take a look on google if you want to dig deeper. Although the story caused an bit of a scare at the time, I think mostly the concerns were thought to be unfounded later. Here's a link I found to a couple of articles published in 2002 in UK https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2002/jul ... dwellbeing
and the US http://edition.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/cond ... index.html

As for sleep I understand progesterone can help with that as I know from personal experience (but again I'm not a doc & so not prescribing or anything!)

Again welcome to the site and look forward to hearing more from both of you.

Best
~Karengo
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"For whatever we lose like a you or a me, it's always ourselves we find in the sea"

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slacker
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Re: Sleep!

Postby slacker » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:58 am

Lindajane wrote:I too am 65 and started HRT a few months ago on a very low dose, Biest 1mg: Pro 40mg. I have not taken hormones before. I soon noticed not feeling as peaceful and calm. Maybe less libido. I know my memory is no better. My doctor has just doubled the dosage. How long should I wait to see improvement? I'm not averse to taking them just not wanting to spend money needlessly and surely not if there is no reason. My estradiol was 8.3 and progesterone 0.3 before starting the HRT. I will have labs redone after taking the new dose for a month or so.

Also, has anyone here in their 60s taken HRTs and seen improvement?


A few of us have reported not feeling improvement or having improved lab results until we switched from topical estradiol compounded creams to prescription estradiol patches. I wonder if you are in this category. Worth discussing with your doctor if you aren't getting good results on the higher doses.

How are you taking the prometrium? Topical or pill?
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xactly
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Re: Sleep!

Postby xactly » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:09 am

Lindajane wrote:I too am 65 and started HRT a few months ago on a very low dose, Biest 1mg: Pro 40mg. I have not taken hormones before. I soon noticed not feeling as peaceful and calm. Maybe less libido.


You did not mention testosterone supplementation. I don't know what others who take bHRT think about this subject, but testosterone, IMO, is important for libido as well as building muscle. You might want to ask your provider to check your testosterone level and supplement to bring you to an appropriate target.

Lindajane
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Re: Sleep!

Postby Lindajane » Sat Jul 07, 2018 1:23 pm

Thanks Slacker, I use the topical cream. If things don't improve with the higher dose I will talk with my doctor about the patches.

Xactly, don't have my labs with me right now but my doctor did not mention testosterone. Another thing I will put on my list to talk with him about. I know DHEA can also help, so that's also on my list of questions.

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Re: Sleep!

Postby cwicker » Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:32 am

Verax wrote:I am not sure that the short sleeping has actually had any adverse health effects, but it is socially unacceptable since I also generally fall asleep too early (extreme "lark" when others are "owls"). What has helped is realizing this syndrome is not my fault but a probable undiagnosed advance phase circadian sleep disorder (phase shorter than solar cycle, advancing each day). I can try to delay my circadian rhythm including sleep cycle by a combination of interventions. I now take the melatonin if I awaken early, even if I can't get back to sleep. Sleep doctors don't agree on this, as they think it might be dangerous driving and promote narcolepsy, but it is worth a try if only based on my anecdote. So instead of no blue or cyan light after sunset and melatonin at bedtime, use melatonin in the middle of the night and no blue light until sunrise. Also to delay the sleep cycle, use caffeine later. Caffeine and melatonin might protect against Alzheimer's, but I haven't seen a human study. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22959965

Circadian sleep disorders might be associated with variants in the PER clock gene. I have a rare variant in the PER3 gene that has been studied, aiding my amateur self-diagnosis. http://www.neuron.illinois.edu/files/U3_L4_CheckpointB_FamilialAdvancedSleepPhaseSyndrome.pdf (PDF).


I have the same PER variant. Additionally, 23 and me tells my I'm genetically prone to be a light sleeper. I think all this contributes to my insomnia. I'm happy to wake up at 3:30 or 4 and start my day. But I find in the summer, with long days, I struggle with falling asleep at my needed early hour and therefore start a cycle of insomnia as I'm still up and ready to go at the early hour my genetics seem to dictate. My anxiety over the link to Alzheimer's makes the insomnia worse. It's the one factor I can't seem to control. Since I feel so good that early in the morning and productive, no matter how much sleep I get, I don't really want to take melatonin in the middle of the night.

Anyway, headed to the doctor this AM for a Trazadone rx so I will have it on hand if purposeful sleep restriction doesn't seem to work.
Perhaps it could be a summer medication. I'm better when days are shorter

Verax
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Re: Sleep!

Postby Verax » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:11 am

More light in evening for bedtime 9 or 10 and 3mg melatonin (not sustained release) when I awaken at 4 has worked for me to delay sleep cycle and get 7-8hr sleep. Melatonin at bedtime didn't work. BTW, I am fast caffeine metabolizer.

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Re: Sleep!

Postby cwicker » Sat Jul 28, 2018 11:33 am

I think we are genetic twins. I am a fast metabolizer as well. I'm just not ready to give up my 4 AM fantastic feeling yet. But, I could use the extra sleep.....


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