George & Ski, I have NO idea how niacin affects HDL-P, but it's certainly worth keeping an eye on...
This is the most definitive research I’ve seen that demonstrates high HDL-C (with low HDL-P) promotes atherosclerosis- at least in the carotid arteries. The graphic below beautifully illustrates risk levels. High HDL-C without high HDL-P (1.55 x more progression) is more atherogenic than low HDL-C combined with low HDL-P (1.29 x more progression.) The most protective combination is high HDL-C with high HDL-P.
For those with high HDL-C, this is a good reason not to assume your HDL is cardio-protective. An NMR (revealing HDL-P) can help you identify your true risk.
Progression of Carotid Atherosclerosis in a Cardiovascular Disease-Free Population
http://content.onlinejacc.org/article.a ... paign=JACC
You're both uber-smart and working with great docs. Keep sharing what you learn about niacin's effect on HDL-P. We can all learn from your experimentation.
CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
Julie,
Thanks for posting. This is a quote from the paper you linked:
My HDL-C = 56 mg/dL = 1.45 mmol/l (high)
My HDL-P = 31.1 (medium)
From the chart = 1.19 relative risk
Paleo (6 June 14)
HDL-C = 46 mg/dL = 1.19 mmol/l (med)
HDL-P = 30.8 (med) =
1.16 relative risk
Fasting 36 hours
HDL-C = 58 mg/dL = 1.50 mmol/l (high)
HDL-P = 29.5 (med) =
1.19 relative risk
Carb nite
HDL-C = 48 mg/dL = 1.24 mmol/l (med)
HDL-P = 28.8 (med) =
1.16 relative risk
I don't think I can tell the difference between 1.16 and 1.19 relative risk and I get to the same answer by fasting.
Thanks for posting. This is a quote from the paper you linked:
Recent test (with niacin)HDL-C level was categorized as <1.04 (low), 1.04 to 1.29, ≥1.30 (high) mmol/l, and HDL-P number as <28.0 (low), 28.0 to 31.9, ≥32.0 (high) μmol/l.
My HDL-C = 56 mg/dL = 1.45 mmol/l (high)
My HDL-P = 31.1 (medium)
From the chart = 1.19 relative risk
Paleo (6 June 14)
HDL-C = 46 mg/dL = 1.19 mmol/l (med)
HDL-P = 30.8 (med) =
1.16 relative risk
Fasting 36 hours
HDL-C = 58 mg/dL = 1.50 mmol/l (high)
HDL-P = 29.5 (med) =
1.19 relative risk
Carb nite
HDL-C = 48 mg/dL = 1.24 mmol/l (med)
HDL-P = 28.8 (med) =
1.16 relative risk
I don't think I can tell the difference between 1.16 and 1.19 relative risk and I get to the same answer by fasting.
Tincup
E3,E4
E3,E4
-
- Contributor
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2014 2:42 pm
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
Is an HDL-P of 36.7 umo/L considered medium?
My HDL-C is 74
Is my relative risk a 1.19 too?
My HDL-C is 74
Is my relative risk a 1.19 too?
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
So my HDL-P pretty much tracks my HDL-C, so rise in HDL equals rise in HDL-P.
Pre Niacin:
HDL-C 50 - HDL-P 32.5
Post Niacin:
HDL-C 57 HDL-P 39.3
HDL-C 55 HDL-P 36.5
Pre Niacin:
HDL-C 50 - HDL-P 32.5
Post Niacin:
HDL-C 57 HDL-P 39.3
HDL-C 55 HDL-P 36.5
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
> 32 for HDL-P is considered high (see the quote from the paper in my post above). So is 74 for HDL-C. So both are high. Your relative risk is 1.0.Rshircliff wrote:Is an HDL-P of 36.7 umo/L considered medium?
My HDL-C is 74
Is my relative risk a 1.19 too?
Tincup
E3,E4
E3,E4
-
- Contributor
- Posts: 63
- Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2014 2:42 pm
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
The postings in this thread have been so interesting and a good challenge for my e3/e4 brain. I have read and re read all the posts gaining a bit more each time. The illustration and link you posted about Progression of Carotid Atherosclerosis, Julie, was great , and put hdl-c and hdl-p in such a way i could comprehend it , and how one affects the other.
This thread has also helped me understand more about ketosis,and its role in Brain health, and also Niacin, thanks to George and Ski.................
[quoteJulienne I was thinking - we may be reaching a broad dietary consensus. Its very exciting. Maybe macronutrient percentages are a red herring.
High veggies. Lowish protein. Limit carbs especially starchy carbs. Drive glycaemic control to perfection. Fat anywhere in the percentage spectrum really but try to maintain a bit of mild ketosis, or go for high ketosis with high fat if you wish BUT watch your lipids respond and back off if they go nasty. It might not matter really how much ketosis over a threshold. Limit saturated fat.
][/quote]
Stavia points out whilst discussing ketosis that we may be nearer to a dietary consensus, which i know you were passionate about Julie,
maybe one is forthcoming?
I have to say i am so glad i found this forum, its more than enough to keep my brain active, and a lot of nice people too, maybe the E4 allele adds a degree of being nice to the personality ..........Paul
This thread has also helped me understand more about ketosis,and its role in Brain health, and also Niacin, thanks to George and Ski.................
[quoteJulienne I was thinking - we may be reaching a broad dietary consensus. Its very exciting. Maybe macronutrient percentages are a red herring.
High veggies. Lowish protein. Limit carbs especially starchy carbs. Drive glycaemic control to perfection. Fat anywhere in the percentage spectrum really but try to maintain a bit of mild ketosis, or go for high ketosis with high fat if you wish BUT watch your lipids respond and back off if they go nasty. It might not matter really how much ketosis over a threshold. Limit saturated fat.
][/quote]
Stavia points out whilst discussing ketosis that we may be nearer to a dietary consensus, which i know you were passionate about Julie,
maybe one is forthcoming?
I have to say i am so glad i found this forum, its more than enough to keep my brain active, and a lot of nice people too, maybe the E4 allele adds a degree of being nice to the personality ..........Paul
Don't wait for your ship to come in, row out to meet it.
- Gilgamesh
- Contributor
- Posts: 1711
- Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:31 am
- Location: Northeast US mostly
- Contact:
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
Just noticed this. Oy, I think they've got it backwards -- either that or they're talking about the complete elimination of methionine from the diet, which, of course, is different from the kind of reduction any normal human could achieve. (As wtih the diff. between reducing energy intake and eliminating energy intake -- the former improves health, the latter causes death.)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25523462
GB
Lowering methionine upregulates the transsulfuration pathway, is my understanding. This is thought to be one sig. reason why vegetarians live longer than meat-eaters.Downsizing of lean body mass is a key determinant of Alzheimer's disease
Met-restricted regimens downregulate the transsulfuration cascade ...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25380591
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25523462
GB
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
G, I'm confused...Is this in the right place? FWIW, this paper & these authors were not at the conference. I'm guessing you're rebutting the notion that sarcopenia drives neurodegeneration- but I could be totally wrong. FWIW, no rational was given; certainly not this one.
I claim be thoroughly confused at this point For me, it's all about moderation and balance. I'm still practicing CR, but trying to eat a little more protein- balancing the methionine with glycine. I'm also lifting heavier weights several times a week- trying to rebuild muscle. I've gotten stupidly small (like many here) and have a gut feeling that may ultimately be counterproductive...
I claim be thoroughly confused at this point For me, it's all about moderation and balance. I'm still practicing CR, but trying to eat a little more protein- balancing the methionine with glycine. I'm also lifting heavier weights several times a week- trying to rebuild muscle. I've gotten stupidly small (like many here) and have a gut feeling that may ultimately be counterproductive...
Re: CONFERENCE The Role of Nutrition in Dementia Prevention and Management March 26 - 27, 2015
G, did you mean this post to continue your dialog with apod in NBC Nightly News & Dr. Isaacson Tonight?