Effectiveness of Bredesen's Protocol for the Eighties

[Tincup]

I sure as hell hope so. I'm 84, my cognitive evaluations show me average for my age, but I see plenty of room for improvement. At least I still have enough wits to follow the protocol and plenty of motivation to do the hard things that need to be done. I just hope I don't have to replace my amalgam fillings.

I think the key is your willingness to change.

[Luk'n4Help]

It is hard to answer your questions without knowing more about your parents. Some testing is needed and not that expensive. For $100 you can get 23andMe DNA with health to get a number of genes tested, including ApoE4. You say that your parents have noticed cognitive decline, and this gene is a good indicator of type of illness. One copy of ApoE4 variant increases Alzheimer's risk by about 15%, while two copies increase by much more. What is your family history for dementia and early death? You ask about cost/benefit of intervention, but that depends greatly on life expectancy. Have your parents been tested for diabetes? Another inexpensive test (A1c). These all can affect diet. Whether they need to severely cut carbs, or just sugar depends on how insulin sensitive they are (diabetes). If they are healthy diabetes-wise, then just cutting out added corn syrup and fruit juices could help. Staying away from white starches (potatoes, rice, bread) and sticking to brown rice and whole grains and yams can help, but may not be needed. I'm a 20 year diabetic, and I try to limit almost ALL carbs, but again, that is just me. In terms of coffee and coke, just keep away from the sugar. I don't much like diet cokes, but I believe they are better for you than the sugar. Same for flavored water. If they are 0 calorie, then probably okay. I prefer to stay away from artificial sweeteners as well, but better than the sugar. You don't need to do anything radical at start. Moderately increasing exercise is almost always helpful. Get some basic testing done. Some cognitive decline with age is common, and may not progress significantly - what is your family history?

Hi mike,

Thanks so much for your thoughts and recommendations here. Really helpful! I have passed that on to my folks and we'll be talking about it. I will try to answer your question about family history. I some facts are not known.

RE my mom:

• Father died at 69, coronary disease, never smoked
  Mother died at 80, acute Lupus believed to be due to common drug of the day (procanamide - Pronestal spelling?)
  Paternal grandmother lived into her 80's, don't know state of alertness
  Paternal grandfather died around 60 from oral cancer due to chewing tobacco
  One maternal aunt (out of 11 children) was mentally handicapped from a young age, but not dementia
  Paternal aunt died about 75 of stroke
  Brother died at 75 of COPD (Chronic obstructive pulmonary disease), had had a massive heart attack at 55, major change to diet, quit smoking, major increase to exercise at that point.
  Sister still living at 85, mentally clear, but probably has some SCI

RE my dad:

• Father died at 70 from lung cancer, quit smoking at 25, but worked in office full of 2nd hand smoke, had held 3 positions for the burough until retirement at 62/63, then still retained one of the positions for a number of years until he felt it had gotten to be too much (SCI??) but others felt he was still fairly sharp to the end
  Mother died at 88, ovarian cancer, mentally sharp to the end
  Maternal uncle died 83, dementia starting maybe at 80, severe by time of death
  Maternal aunt died early 70's of stomach cancer
  Maternal uncle died of colon cancer, unknown age
  Maternal uncle died of pancreatic cancer, "relatively early"
  Paternal aunt died of breast cancer, late 60's or early 70's
  Paternal grandfather died at 93, senile maybe last 6 years of his life
  Paternal grandmother died at 73?, severely invalid, mentally impaired from multiple strokes, likely due to uncontrolled hypertension the last 5 years

Regarding diabetes,

• Mom: pre-diabetic for maybe 5 years, diagnosed with Type 2 (Adult onset) about 6 months ago. has Insulin resistance problem, taking oral medication for it. (Also my mom had had a virus go to her heart back in '96 - Idiopathic dilated myocardopathy - one valve was no longer closing properly when the heart pumped. Only a small percentage live several years. She's still going 22 years later!)
  Dad: insulin level was measured a number of months ago and was well in the acceptable range, 5.4

They both are trying to walk consistently each evening. Not sure how many minute or far they walk.

Thank you so much for all your recommendations. I'll be looking forward to hearing back from you.

[Luk'n4Help]

I'm 84, my cognitive evaluations show me average for my age, but I see plenty of room for improvement. At least I still have enough wits to follow the protocol and plenty of motivation to do the hard things that need to be done. I just hope I don't have to replace my amalgam fillings.

Hi Josiah,

Thanks for chiming in here! Would you mind if I ask a few questions?

• Are you currently using the ReCODE protocol?
  What measures are you taking to improve your brain health?
  Are you doing all the supplements?
  How long have you been doing it?
  Does it seem to be helping?
  Are you seeing a certified practitioner regularly, or working with a coach, or are you more doing this on your own?

Sorry for all the questions. Just looking for help for my folks. I really appreciate any input you can give.

Thanks much!

[Luk'n4Help]

Hi Luk'n4help and Josiah, FYI there is always room for improvement! I began working with a client in his mid-eighties last summer who was experiencing some mild cognitive decline and his family says that when he is fully on the nutritional plan and in ketosis (he does very well with the exercise, stress management, social and other important components of the ReCODE Protocol) that he is more alert and responsive. He himself says that he is more energized. He is also working with a Bredesen trained physician and is on a full complement of supplements and following a detoxification protocol. As a side benefit his wife, also in her mid-eighties has lost approximately 30 pounds. Good luck!

Hi Sara,

Thanks much for your encouragement here! That is really good news!

Thanks again.

[Luk'n4Help]

1~ A lot of Bredesen trained providers do telehealth, working via phone or computer video-conference with patients/clients at a distance. Some of the physicians require an initial, in person visit, to get started working together.

2~this is an interesting question, and like many other areas, there are probably quite a few different opinions. I can just offer you mine: the lifestyle changes, to whatever extent that they can be made, are most likely beneficial for everyone. Reducing stress is one of those lifestyle areas, so if the dietary changes would create a lot of stress, then modifying the recommendations so that there is some improvement and at the same time it is not overwhelming to them could be a way to start. For things like hormone levels, related to trophic support, yes, testing would be required to see where the levels are. Many tests can be covered by insurance as part of routine physicals. But correcting for hormonal deficiencies that could be contributing to Type 2 AD would require prescription meds that many mainstream docs are not willing to prescribe (in my experience).

Hi floramaria,

I'm still rather new at all this on this forum, so you may not have been notified of my response to you above (my bad!). I'll repeat just a part of my response, but maybe you'd want to look at my full response earlier.

In response to your answers above, I'd have a follow-up question:
1&2. I don't know what my parent's take on this would be, but would there be an FM or a Coach that you could recommend that would not require an in office visit, nor a battery of expensive tests?

Thanks again, and sorry for not responding previously directly to your message above.

[floramaria]

I'm still rather new at all this on this forum, so you may not have been notified of my response to you above (my bad!). I'll repeat just a part of my response, but maybe you'd want to look at my full response earlier.

In response to your answers above, I'd have a follow-up question:
1&2. I don't know what my parent's take on this would be, but would there be an FM or a Coach that you could recommend that would not require an in office visit, nor a battery of expensive tests?

Thanks again, and sorry for not responding previously directly to your message above.

Hi Luk'n'4Help,
Thanks for re-posting the question.
For Bredesen-trained and Bredesen-aware practitioners, one resource is our Wiki. For many people finding a practitioner is an excercise in sorting through available options via phone calls and emails for that "needle -in-the-haystack"! The Institute of Functional Medicine has a listing of practitioners that can be searched by state; for each person, there is a list of what trainings that person has taken. If you specifically are looking for someone who has taken Dr Bredesen's training, then name of the course you'd look for is Reversing Cognitive Decline. Their listings include doctors, nurses, doctors of Oriental Medicine, chiropractors, and more, but not health coaches. I think that the Functional Medicine Coaching Academy retains a listing of its graduates (all health coaches) for referral purposes. InternationaI Consortium for Wealth and Wellness Coaches also keeps a list of health coaches who have passed their certification exam.
Signing up for the year long ReCODE program through AHNP gives you access to listings of all Bredesen-trained practitioners.

[floramaria]

According to the typical descriptions of the various types of Alzheimer's, it would seem that they could be showing signs for Type 2 Alzheimer's, but that has not been officially determined.
The question they are wanting me to help them wrestle through is looking at the cost of the programs along with the mental and emotional stress from a disruption of daily routine, compared to the potential of extended usefulness. They also consider that the rate of heart disease, stroke, and cancer increase with age, not wanting to regain a healthy brain only to be caught by one of these other major health problems.
So, are there any studies (or other factors that could be beneficial when considering this question) regarding the general longevity, and cognitive longevity, of those in their eighty's?
Grateful for any info you can offer.

Testing first: There is a big batch of tests listed in Dr Bredesen's book. The full "Cognoscopy" attempts to test ranges for for as many possible contributing factors as possible, thereby directing the treatment plan. For someone who is already impaired and needs to get all the relevant information ASAP to turn things around, this comprehensive approach provides information that is extremely valuable for assessing where the focus needs to be and prioritizing interventions.
Many people take a more step by step approach, especially if their cognitive function is still good and they are dealing with either prevention, subjective cognitive impairment or beginning of mild cognitive impairment.
It may seem like we are a bit of a broken record on recommending the Primer, but that is only because it such a phenomenal resource. It is a great help in getting started prioritizing steps and if gradual approach is the way they want to proceed, the list of tests under Biomarkers, near the end of the Primer would be one approach. Since you are concerned about possibility of Type 2, complete hormone panel could also be added. Most of those tests would be covered by insurance if requested by a doctor. From personal experience and what i hear from others, many, if not most, docs would be willing to write the requisition for these tests without being specially trained in cognitive function. They are pretty standard tests.

risks: The weighing and balancing risks for all health problems is delicate and highly personal. A knowledgeable doctor could help with that, but ultimately, so much is just unknown. You find someone you feel you can trust, or you trust yourself, but no matter what, there are hard choices to be made. Earlier today, I was reading Juliegee's post listing real risks of CVD, as shown by actual incidents, versus factors used to predict CVD, which, in this study at least, appear to be almost irrelevant. an example of how new information is appearing all the time and some of it undermines what has been held to be true. If you are following Dr Bredesen, you are looking at biomarkers through a particular lens.

As for your sense that hormones may be important factors, it is easy and not expensive to test levels. But can be tricky getting treatment, especially as far as HRT for older women.
As an example, my own previous doctor absolutely would not prescribe estradiol for me, and considers me an abject fool for :
a) believing that hormones are important for preserving cognitive function
b) believing the risk they pose has been overstated
c) paying through the nose to a "concierge" doctor so I could get the hormones in spite of her advise.

Even though I admitted freely that I could be wrong and that sher could be right, and said that I wanted to make my own choice based on my own sense of risks, no amount of my saying I'd take responsibility for my own choice helped. It came down to "you believe that, and I believe something else."

In the area of willingness to embrace more cutting edge therapies, or to listen and respect the wishes of the patient, Functional Medicine doctors may be a better bet. Also a more expensive one, I think, based on my very limited experience. Many do not accept insurance. Some people are doing great working through the Bredesen Protocol with their conventional doctors.

Sorry there are not better answers, Luk'n'4Help. At the same time, we have so much more information, understanding, and reason to hope than at any time in the past.
And though it is a complex subject, at least you can know that here on this website you are in a group of people dedicated to doing the best to sort out and discuss areas of importance and make the best choices we can for ourselves.
Keep those questions coming....but don't forget to read the Primer


sending you best wishes,
floramaria

[Luk'n4Help]

... It may seem like we are a bit of a broken record on recommending the Primer, but that is only because it such a phenomenal resource. It is a great help in getting started prioritizing steps and if gradual approach is the way they want to proceed, the list of tests under Biomarkers, near the end of the Primer would be one approach. ...
sending you best wishes,
floramaria

Hi floramaria,

Thank you SO much for all the time you have put into thoroughly answering my questions. I am very grateful. Both the Wiki you mentioned and the Primer have a TON of information! And thank you for all the other resources you mentioned for practitioners and coaches. That is really great too.

All of this gives me a lot of reading to do, and a lot of discussing with my parents. Thank you for your concern and your encouragement. I'll post again as we have more questions.

Gratefully,
Luk'n4Help

[mike]

They both are trying to walk consistently each evening. Not sure how many minute or far they walk.

This area is critical for both the pre-diabetes and dementia, so good to get a better idea of what they are doing now, and what their doctors think they are capable of. Walking is great, but also good to get some resistance training and interval work. This is an area where you want to go slow - build up to higher levels, making sure not to get injured by doing too much too fast. I work with a physical therapist now, because of injuries in the past.

http://time.com/5162477/exercise-risk-dementia/

https://www.aarp.org/health/healthy-liv ... ut-fd.html

In terms of your family history, you could still have ApoE4, since it often expresses itself in men with cardio problems, and many died young from other diseases before dementia could show itself. I would still go ahead and do the 23andMe testing.

[Josiah]

I'm 84, my cognitive evaluations show me average for my age, but I see plenty of room for improvement. At least I still have enough wits to follow the protocol and plenty of motivation to do the hard things that need to be done. I just hope I don't have to replace my amalgam fillings.

Hi Josiah,

Thanks for chiming in here! Would you mind if I ask a few questions?

• Are you currently using the ReCODE protocol?
  What measures are you taking to improve your brain health?
  Are you doing all the supplements?
  How long have you been doing it?
  Does it seem to be helping?
  Are you seeing a certified practitioner regularly, or working with a coach, or are you more doing this on your own?

Sorry for all the questions. Just looking for help for my folks. I really appreciate any input you can give.

Thanks much!

In answer to your questions, I only became aware of ReCode a couple of months ago, but I've been moving with all deliberate speed to become totally compliant ASAP. I'm in ketosis and have been intermittent fasting for a while. I'm probably compliant with half the supplements. Where I'm not compliant is in the area of testing. Next week I will have an initial phone conference with a certified ReCode health coach. It's too early to talk about benefits, but even prior to reading Dr. Bredesen's book my life style conformed quite well with what is expected