Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Alzheimer's, cardiovascular, and other chronic diseases; biomarkers, lifestyle, supplements, drugs, and health care.
Plumster
Senior Contributor
Senior Contributor
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:19 pm

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by Plumster »

Can someone clarify Gundry's current position on bone broth?
Hi bexnews,

Books take a while to publish, so he may have changed his mind too late for the publication. I do find it slightly irresponsible to not make your position clear in regard to your own book.

I'd personally stay away from bone broth, regardless of what Gundry says, because of the lead in bones.
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/how-mu ... one-broth/
e3/4 MTHFR C677T/A1298C COMT V158M++ COMT H62H++ MTRR A66G ++ HLA DR
circular
Senior Contributor
Senior Contributor
Posts: 5565
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:43 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by circular »

I’m drinking Bonafide chicken bone broth this very moment, hoping it will be helpful as I work through the stomach flu. Their website says they lab test for metals and lead and there’s no detectable lead (no word there on the other metals tested). I don’t normally drink it, but some people get grass fed and finished bones and make their own.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
bexnews
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Jan 19, 2017 3:58 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by bexnews »

Plumster wrote:
Can someone clarify Gundry's current position on bone broth?
Hi bexnews,

Books take a while to publish, so he may have changed his mind too late for the publication. I do find it slightly irresponsible to not make your position clear in regard to your own book.

I'd personally stay away from bone broth, regardless of what Gundry says, because of the lead in bones.
https://nutritionfacts.org/video/how-mu ... one-broth/
Yes, I thought, oh maybe the book took a while to publish. But as I said, in his recent product launch, Peak Mobility, he was talking about how good bone broth is, so they added GLUCOSAMINE SULFATE to the formula. You might think he'd add something like "all the benefits without the problems of bone broth"
Robhypno
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:44 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by Robhypno »

Thank you for this, and of course all the other posts

Just completely confused

Keto

Bredesen keto flex

Grundy plant

Which diet is recommended for E4?

They sort of conflict on major points
User avatar
SusanJ
Senior Contributor
Senior Contributor
Posts: 3059
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:33 am
Location: Western Colorado

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by SusanJ »

Robhypno wrote:Which diet is recommended for E4?
We don't know. There is no one-fits-all diet. We're all different, and all process carbs and fats differently.

That said, you need to find the right mix of foods that allow you to keep insulin sensitivity (low A1c, insulin) and your lipids in a reasonable range. For most of us, that means concentrating on non-starchy veggies, limiting sugar and simple carbs, and eating healthy fats like EVOO, nuts and avocados.

And look at your family history. If you have diabetes in your family tree, then it is likely you'll need to reign in carbs significantly because you have likely inherited the same tendencies. If there is heart disease, then you need to prioritize gut health and insure you don't have food intolerances that might lead to inflammation.

I know some here think that high lipids don't matter if you are insulin sensitive, but personally I err on the side of not letting my lipids drift too high. I can do that by watching my saturated fat intake. If you have other inflammation, auto-immune disease or can't get your labs into comfortable ranges, I'd say, then it's time to look at limiting certain other foods, and you can look at Gundry's suggestions on high lectin foods or other approaches. I'd personally recommend looking at Sarah Ballantyne's work on the auto-immune protocol. It's a very nuanced view on what components of what foods might be problematic for folks. And she references all the studies to back up her thinking in her books.

And lastly, I'll paraphrase Dr. Stavia, who reminds us that any diet protocol we follow must be sustainable. Don't think you can give up that tomato or piece of artisan bread? Well, it might be that sometimes you just go ahead and eat it, enjoy it and then go back to your basic diet protocol tomorrow.

Just start - track your food, blood sugar response and symptoms for a while and you'll start to develop your own, eat this, not that, list.

Good luck!
User avatar
TheresaB
Mod
Mod
Posts: 1613
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 9:46 am
Location: Front Range, CO

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by TheresaB »

Robhypno wrote:Just completely confused

Keto

Bredesen keto flex

Grundy plant

Which diet is recommended for E4?
Interesting you find the two conflicting. I’ve been following Dr Bredesen for years and have been a patient of Dr Gundry for years and find the divergences to be minor. Dr Gundry’s Plant Paradox book came out in April 2017, I read it right away, Dr Bredesen’s The End of Alzheimer’s book came out a few months later in August 2017 and read it right away too, although having followed him, I’d heard of much of what he’d addressed in the book.

Having read both books nearly back to back, I found much overlap between with them being quite complementary despite the fact one is a general health diet book and the other is a book specifically addressing Alzheimer's.

Dr Gundry emphasizes diet specifically, since that’s what he does as a practicing physician. He’s a heart surgeon turned functional doctor, which he calls restorative medicine. Around 18 years ago or so, he realized he no longer wanted to cut on diseased individuals when he knew he could help them heal themselves through diet and supplements.

Dr Bredesen addresses the pathologies of Alzheimer’s disease and strategies to address them, but having been a researcher in the lab all his life, his dietary recommendations are more generalized.

Dr Bredesen tends to recommend strictly from a cognition/neurodegenerative perspective.

Dr Gundry tends to recommend from an overall health/longevity perspective, in fact his next book coming out in March addresses longevity specifically.

Both recommend ketosis for cognition issues.

Both recommend meat as a condiment.

Both emphasize maintaining a low HbA1c, blood sugar and insulin levels.

Both offer strategies to keep inflammation low.

Both emphasize a low homocysteine level.

Where they have diverged in the past, I’ve noticed recent convergence:
  • -Dr Bredesen recommended staying away from gluten, whereas Dr Gundry went beyond that recommending reducing lectin consumption, in a recent podcast Dr Bredesen discussed reducing lectins.

    -Dr Bredesen recommends MCT oil largely because it can produce a brain/cognitive boost through ketones. Dr Gundry is a little more hesitant, especially for ApoE4s because of the saturated fat content, only recommending it if cognition is an issue.

    -Dr Gundry recommended niacinamide for us, Dr Bredesen has mentioned nicotinamide riboside. Nicotinamide robiside is expensive. In his consultations Dr Gundry tries to be mindful of the cost of the supplements he recommends, he’s said all things being equal he also prefers nicotinamide robiside, but niacinamide is cheaper. They do diverge on homocysteine level a bit. Dr Gundry has observed niacinamide tends to raise homocysteine a bit, so he’s a little more relaxed than Dr Bredesen.

    -I’m sure there’s more.
Which diet is recommended for E4?
There is no diet that everyone can agree upon is the best for an ApoE4 carrier.

Dr Bredesen makes his recommendations for all genotypes although he is extremely familiar with the ApoE4 allele and its unique issues and discusses it in his book.

Dr Gundry is also very familiar with the ApoE4 allele. Shortly after he began his restorative medicine practice, he started testing for it along with many other biomarkers and over the years he’s observed unique qualities/responses that his ApoE4 patients had. He addresses ApoE4 in his Plant Paradox book, although only lightly. Dr Gundry has a video where he presents his dietary recommendations for ApoE4s and a summation of those recommendations and a link to Dr Gundry's video can be found in the Wiki, Dr Gundry's Protocol https://wiki.apoe4.info/wiki/Dr_Gundry%27s_Protocol
-Theresa
ApoE 4/4
Robhypno
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:44 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by Robhypno »

Thank you for the detailed information

My blood sugar a1 etc is low

Cholesterol is again all good

My CRP is good

Mum has AD and to my knowledge no CVD on either side despite being E4

I am doing full ketogenic diet and all seems well. My bmi was 26,6 but now 24.9. I've lost 17 lbs in 5 weeks. I was never excessively overweight but I'm very happy that I've lost the stubborn body fat

I think perhaps I've read so much that I'm over complicated it somewhat.

I was always anxious about high fat in take and maybe my meat intake is a bit high with full keto which brought on some confusion

Again, thank you. I shall put the books down for a while keep with full keto til the end of the year and review

As far as my anecdotal opinion is, I feel amazing and huge increase in energy.
circular
Senior Contributor
Senior Contributor
Posts: 5565
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2013 10:43 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by circular »

Robhypno wrote:Just completely confused

Keto

Bredesen keto flex

Grundy plant

Which diet is recommended for E4?

They sort of conflict on major points
Susan and Theresa have given great responses. Be patient with yourself. It’s a lot to digest.

Some may want to start with the Mind diet or Finger trial diet and fine tune from there:
[With the Mind diet] the overall rate of change in cognitive score was a decline of 0.8 standardized score units per year. In mixed models adjusted for a variety of relevant factors, including age, sex, education, total energy intake, APOE4 carrier status, and participation in cognitive activities, the MIND diet score was "positively and statistically significantly" associated with slower decline in global cognitive score (β = 0.0092; P < .0001) and with five cognitive domains, especially episodic memory, semantic memory, and perceptual speed, the researchers report.
"The difference in decline rates for being in the top tertile of MIND diet scores versus the lowest was equivalent to being 7.5 years younger in age," they write.
One interesting finding from the [Finger] trial is that, if you have ApoE4, which is the main genetic risk factor, it seems that the effect of modifying lifestyle factors may be even stronger.
Don’t mean to complicate things further, but these diets have a better peer reviewed foundation for those who value that. I personally do believe the ketogenic and lectin themes are beneficial for at least some of us.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
mike
Senior Contributor
Senior Contributor
Posts: 858
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:55 pm
Location: CA - Sonoma County

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by mike »

Robhypno wrote:I was always anxious about high fat in take and maybe my meat intake is a bit high with full keto which brought on some confusion
I would personally like to see some research specific to ApoE4s and Meat intake. Before I found this site, I started following a keto diet based mostly on meat protein, very low carbs and moderate fat. I've been on it for 2+ years, and it has been working for me. Lost 60 lbs first year, and put on a bunch of muscle the second year without gaining weight. Not required for the diet, but recommended is fasting - everything from time constricted eating, to long term water only fasts. I've done a 13 and a 17 day water fast last year, and I'm currently on my 3rd day of a new fast. I'm hoping to go about 3 weeks and lose maybe 20 lbs (10% of body weight). The body gets rid of stuff that is not needed or is not working well. I will likely gain about half back after I start re-feeding. The hope is that this rebuilding is done via stem cells from original blue prints, instead of cell division.
Sonoma Mike
4/4
hairyfairy
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 107
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:12 am

Re: Dr. Steven Gundry with diet recommendations for ApoE4

Post by hairyfairy »

Iv`e read that Intermittent fasting is very good for the brain, It`s supposed to help with neuroregeneration.
Post Reply