Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

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Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby PBW » Sat Jul 20, 2019 10:13 am

My neighbor uses 20 min infrared therapy and fasting to reduce pain(usually headaches from rare neural condition). I am using wim Hof breathing, cold exposure (showers and emersion in >65 degree natural waters) and 16 hour daily fasts to reduce fear and aversion to cold, increase the dilation and contraction in all veins arteries and capillaries , and prevention of 4/4 adverse effects to quality of life. I have read some on HSP with Heat and RMB3 with cold. Just wondering if anyone else has info in this area.

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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby TheresaB » Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:46 pm

I've used photobiomodulation, previously known as Low Level Laser Therapy (LLLT), which applies red and near-infrared light for pain and inflammation purposes due to an orthopedic issue. It's warm, but not stressful, never thought I was activating heat shock proteins. I sauna regularly for the purpose of activating HSPs along with the its other benefits.
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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby PBW » Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:53 pm

Thanks Theresa.Here is the most recent article I read : https://joshmitteldorf.scienceblog.com/ ... old-shock/. My neighbor is a fitness geek like me and he actually gave me all the HSP info saying it did the same thing more effectively than cold. I think the cold therapy is a better fit for me, but am trying to research it more.
I haven't spoken with you in awhile. I hope you are well. I had first appt with Mitsu in Jan(Palm Springs and my second appt is with Dr Gundry on Aug 12. I am busy making my list of questions to send to him prior to our appt. I will report what is going on after I meet with him.

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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby TheresaB » Sat Jul 20, 2019 4:16 pm

PBW wrote: I had first appt with Mitsu in Jan(Palm Springs and my second appt is with Dr Gundry on Aug 12. I am busy making my list of questions to send to him prior to our appt. I will report what is going on after I meet with him.


Oh great! Yeah, let me know!
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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby PBW » Sat Jul 20, 2019 9:52 pm

Definitely...thanks to you both for letting me know about Mitsu joining him and his practice opening again.

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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby johnseed » Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:39 am

TheresaB wrote:I've used photobiomodulation, previously known as Low Level Laser Therapy (LLLT), which applies red and near-infrared light for pain and inflammation purposes due to an orthopedic issue. It's warm, but not stressful, never thought I was activating heat shock proteins. I sauna regularly for the purpose of activating HSPs along with the its other benefits.


What temperature are your saunas Theresa? Do you have any evidence for the relationship of temperature to HSP's?

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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby TheresaB » Tue Aug 06, 2019 6:23 am

johnseed wrote:What temperature are your saunas Theresa? Do you have any evidence for the relationship of temperature to HSP's?


I don't mean to come off as flippant, but our sauna is home made and the temperature is whatever it is when I walk in. When fully warmed up, it does tend to range from in the 120s to 130s, but because our sauna is a converted bathtub sized walk-in shower stall, I sit very close to the heat lamps so it's quite hot (we use heat lamps that emit in the near infrared spectrum, spectrum is important too, not just heat).

Regarding temperature relationship to Heat Shock Proteins, let me refer you to this write-up on everything sauna by Dr Rhonda Patrick: https://www.foundmyfitness.com/topics/s ... k-proteins where she writes:

Heat stress, in particular, robustly activates HSPs.[18] For example, after healthy men and women sat in a heat stress chamber for 30 minutes at 73°C (163°F), their levels of HSP72 increased by 49 percent.[19] In a different study, in which healthy men and women were exposed to deep tissue heat therapy for six days, participants' levels of HSP70 and HSP90 increased 45 percent and 38 percent, respectively.[20] In addition, their biomarkers of mitochondrial biogenesis improved, and their mitochondrial function increased by 28 percent compared to baseline levels. The activation of HSPs is sustained over time, suggesting that heat acclimation induces whole-body adaptations that increase heat tolerance, resulting in protective cellular adaptations.[18]


Dr Patrick probably got much of her information on saunas from Finnish cardiologist and researcher Dr. Jari Laukkanen. Her interview (and transcript) with him regarding his research and findings on Alzheimer's, cardiovascular implications, and longevity can be found at:
Dr. Jari Laukkanen on Sauna Use for the Prevention of Cardiovascular & Alzheimer’s Disease In Dr Laukkanen's research in Finland, the average temperature of the sauna was 79 celsius or 174 F.
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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby Tincup » Tue Aug 06, 2019 8:32 pm

johnseed wrote:What temperature are your saunas Theresa? Do you have any evidence for the relationship of temperature to HSP's?


I built TheresaB's sauna using the plans on p 153 of this PDF. except that I used 4-250 watt bulbs, not 3, in a diamond pattern. The shower is about 2.5'x4'. I insulated it with Reflectix brand aluminum foil faced insulation. Like this though was likely a wider size (30"?). The Reflextix has enough stiffness that I could use duct tape to hold it in place. The tile walls, ceiling and doors are all insulated. Wiring is all heavy duty. Light sockets are porcelain, there is a normal light switch mounted on the board. Use a heavy duty outdoor extension cord to plug the light board into and connect to the wall outlet.

The board that the lights are on is hung from the shower (we don't use this shower as such). We usually let it heat for 20-30 minutes before using. I recently saw a paper posted by Rhonda Patrick in her Found My Fitness Facebook feed that noted a benefit to exercising prior to using the sauna. So, having Schwinn Airdyne fan bike and fan rower, I started doing two Tabata sets (8 cycles of 20 seconds hard and 10 seconds easy) before I used the sauna. My sweating increased significantly. Since I do these daily, I don't push the hard cycles to max. Only 80% of max HR.

We have a wooden stool that we cover with a towel and sit on. We rotate every 5 minutes or so. We also have a towel on the floor of the shower, to catch the sweat.

When I first started, I took my oral temp with a mercury thermometer before and after the sauna, using it for 30 minutes. If memory serves, I got about a 2 deg F increase. I then went to the rec center and did the same with an electrically heated traditional thermal sauna. No idea the air temp. I got 1 to 1.5 deg F increase. So I was comfortable I was getting a similar response from the home machine. On p 123 of the PDF linked above, is a frequency distribution for a Sylvania bulb. I've used two different types of bulbs. Don't know the distribution of the first one and the second supposedly peaks at 850 nm. Wilson has bulb recommendations here.

We use new towels each day, so that any toxins in the sweat are not reabsorbed.

I follow my sauna sessions with a bath using cold tap water for 20 minutes. In the winter it is 46 deg F and a balmy 67 deg F now in the summer. I'm guessing 46 deg F is cold enough to generate some HSP, not sure about 67.
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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby johnseed » Wed Aug 07, 2019 6:42 pm

TheresaB wrote:
johnseed wrote:What temperature are your saunas Theresa? Do you have any evidence for the relationship of temperature to HSP's?


I don't mean to come off as flippant, but our sauna is home made and the temperature is whatever it is when I walk in. When fully warmed up, it does tend to range from in the 120s to 130s, but because our sauna is a converted bathtub sized walk-in shower stall, I sit very close to the heat lamps so it's quite hot (we use heat lamps that emit in the near infrared spectrum, spectrum is important too, not just heat).

Regarding temperature relationship to Heat Shock Proteins, let me refer you to this write-up on everything sauna by Dr Rhonda Patrick: https://www.foundmyfitness.com/topics/s ... k-proteins where she writes:

Heat stress, in particular, robustly activates HSPs.[18] For example, after healthy men and women sat in a heat stress chamber for 30 minutes at 73°C (163°F), their levels of HSP72 increased by 49 percent.[19] In a different study, in which healthy men and women were exposed to deep tissue heat therapy for six days, participants' levels of HSP70 and HSP90 increased 45 percent and 38 percent, respectively.[20] In addition, their biomarkers of mitochondrial biogenesis improved, and their mitochondrial function increased by 28 percent compared to baseline levels. The activation of HSPs is sustained over time, suggesting that heat acclimation induces whole-body adaptations that increase heat tolerance, resulting in protective cellular adaptations.[18]


Dr Patrick probably got much of her information on saunas from Finnish cardiologist and researcher Dr. Jari Laukkanen. Her interview (and transcript) with him regarding his research and findings on Alzheimer's, cardiovascular implications, and longevity can be found at:
Dr. Jari Laukkanen on Sauna Use for the Prevention of Cardiovascular & Alzheimer’s Disease In Dr Laukkanen's research in Finland, the average temperature of the sauna was 79 celsius or 174 F.


Thanks for your reply Theresa. I'm familiar with Dr Patrick's material but would like more info if I can find it concerning increases in HSP's at different temperatures. 130 is a lot more comfortable than 174! But is there any evidence of relative efficacy? The only relevant study I've found so far is Dr Laukkanen these saunas averaged 174. The 70% decrease in incidence of Alzheimer's (and 40% decrease in all cause mortality for men who used saunas 4 to 7 times a week is by far the most efficacious intervention I've read about, would you agree?

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Re: Elevating HSP through Infrared light therapy or/and extreme cold (wim Hof orcryotherapy)

Postby TheresaB » Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:00 am

johnseed wrote:The only relevant study I've found so far is Dr Laukkanen these saunas averaged 174. The 70% decrease in incidence of Alzheimer's (and 40% decrease in all cause mortality for men who used saunas 4 to 7 times a week is by far the most efficacious intervention I've read about, would you agree?


Lots of folks mention/write about the benefits of a sauna, but Dr Laukkanen's work is the only one I'm aware of that investigated it deeply and correlated with Alzheimer's. And Dr Rhonda Patrick is his best mouthpiece.
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