For those with high LDL-P

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Julie G
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For those with high LDL-P

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I just read this informative article What Causes Elevated LDL-Particle Number by Criss Kresser, that out outlines the potential causes for elevated LDL particle number including:

-Insulin resistance
-Poor thyroid function
-Infections
-Leaky Gut
-Genetics

It's a great primer for anyone struggling with high LDL-P and offers lots of suggestions for tracking down and addressing the root cause(s).
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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Thanks for the link to the interesting article. I am surprised, however, that he makes no mention of APOE4 and saturated fat (the combination, in particular) as contributing to high LDL-P. I thought that was a well accepted cause or at least strong association.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

Post by circular »

Julie G wrote:I just read this informative article What Causes Elevated LDL-Particle Number by Criss Kresser, that out outlines the potential causes for elevated LDL particle number including:

-Insulin resistance
-Poor thyroid function
-Infections
-Leaky Gut
-Genetics

It's a great primer for anyone struggling with high LDL-P and offers lots of suggestions for tracking down and addressing the root cause(s).
I just posted about this recent Chris Kresser podcast in which his guest describes another way of looking at high LDL (still to be proven): the "Homeoviscous Adaptation to Dietary Lipids (HADL) Model," but I'm not sure whether LDL-P specifically was mentioned and I didn't recognize it as such.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

Post by Julie G »

I just posted about this recent Chris Kresser podcast in which his guest describes another way of looking at high LDL (still to be proven): the "Homeoviscous Adaptation to Dietary Lipids (HADL) Model," but I'm not sure whether LDL-P specifically was mentioned and I didn't recognize it as such.
Interesting. I need to spend some time wrapping my head around the theory. A quick read doesn't link it to particle number (?) Generally speaking, I tend to think of LDL-C as a red herring. Alone, it doesn't tell us very much, but in the context of particle number and size, ox-LDL, glycemic markers, thyroid markers, inflammatory markers, it becomes more telling...
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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Julie G wrote:
I just posted about this recent Chris Kresser podcast in which his guest describes another way of looking at high LDL (still to be proven): the "Homeoviscous Adaptation to Dietary Lipids (HADL) Model," but I'm not sure whether LDL-P specifically was mentioned and I didn't recognize it as such.
Interesting. I need to spend some time wrapping my head around the theory. A quick read doesn't link it to particle number (?) Generally speaking, I tend to think of LDL-C as a red herring. Alone, it doesn't tell us very much, but in the context of particle number and size, ox-LDL, glycemic markers, thyroid markers, inflammatory markers, it becomes more telling...
I think Marit would agree with you. The niche her research addresses is the absence of good mechanistic studies in the traditional diet vs. heart disease perspective. Marit's saying that she thinks the reason the LDL is high, for example on a high fat diet and in the absence of genetic variants that can cause that, is that the cells don't need to take up any more LDL-C for optimal membrane stabilization. She's also clear that there is a lot of inter-individual variation in LDL-C on high fat diets, and fatty acid balance in the cell membranes may help explain that.

Since Marit's proposing that PUFAs, by increasing membrane fluidity, cause increased uptake of LDL-C to stabilize the membranes, it would be interesting to have a study compare people on a ketogenic (at least higher fat) diet where both baseline and dietary fatty acid breakdowns are recorded. Then they would look at whether these levels correlate with an increase or decrease in LDL-C. Of course that will never happen, so it'll be interesting to see what happens next with her model.

Chris adds that in the absence of more studies verifying her theory, and for other reasons too I'm sure, that if there is a net gain in biomarker trends and other testing (eg, imaging), then the patient is probably on the right track despite high LDL-C.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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Whatnow wrote:Thanks for the link to the interesting article. I am surprised, however, that he makes no mention of APOE4 and saturated fat (the combination, in particular) as contributing to high LDL-P. I thought that was a well accepted cause or at least strong association.
I was surprised too. My N-of-1 study of adding butter and coconut oil to my morning coffee (it was SO good) and coconut oil to my green smoothies SPIKED my LDL-P to almost 1500. Eliminating most sources of saturated fat brought it back down to under 850. So yeah, in my case saturated fat appears to be a huge contributor.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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grommet wrote:
Whatnow wrote:Thanks for the link to the interesting article. I am surprised, however, that he makes no mention of APOE4 and saturated fat (the combination, in particular) as contributing to high LDL-P. I thought that was a well accepted cause or at least strong association.
I was surprised too. My N-of-1 study of adding butter and coconut oil to my morning coffee (it was SO good) and coconut oil to my green smoothies SPIKED my LDL-P to almost 1500. Eliminating most sources of saturated fat brought it back down to under 850. So yeah, in my case saturated fat appears to be a huge contributor.
Yep, for my 4/4 wife & me, too. Our doc, Gundry, doesn't really care much, so we don't drive ours down in the <1000 category most of the time, but we don't strive to be in the >2000 category either. To get mine sub 1000 I do have to eliminate almost all saturated fat, even from EVOO. In our consult with Dayan Goodenowe on our plasmalogen tests, he also likes higher rather than lower cholesterol. I can't tell you who is right...
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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Tincup wrote:Our doc, Gundry, doesn't really care much ...
Hi Tincup, has Dr. Gundry said why he doesn't care much if LDL-P is higher? I'm just curious to hear more about his perspective on this. Maybe it's in one of his books, but I haven't had time to read books in years, and my audio format while doing other things gets consumed with much shorter podcasts.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

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circular wrote:
Tincup wrote:Our doc, Gundry, doesn't really care much ...
Hi Tincup, has Dr. Gundry said why he doesn't care much if LDL-P is higher? I'm just curious to hear more about his perspective on this. Maybe it's in one of his books, but I haven't had time to read books in years, and my audio format while doing other things gets consumed with much shorter podcasts.
On one or more of our early transcripts he mentions (his opinion) of the purpose of LDL-P testing is to convince people to take statins. As you may recall, he is interested in TG/HDL <=1 (in mg/dL units), sd LDL-C < 30 mg/dL and ox LDL. As I recall, your sd LDL was ~12, so not an issue for you. He also looks at a lot of different inflammatory markers. More recently, he looks at the PULS test.
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Re: For those with high LDL-P

Post by circular »

Tincup wrote: On one or more of our early transcripts he mentions (his opinion) of the purpose of LDL-P testing is to convince people to take statins. As you may recall, he is interested in TG/HDL <=1 (in mg/dL units), sd LDL-C < 30 mg/dL and ox LDL. As I recall, your sd LDL was ~12, so not an issue for you. He also looks at a lot of different inflammatory markers. More recently, he looks at the PULS test.
Thanks Tincup. I'm honored that you would remember my sdLDL from so long ago! :lol:

My TG/HDL, sdLDL and oxLDL are all good. I'm still flumoxed by mildly but chronically elevated hsCRP, which may be from chronic bursitis (?). Does he ignore:

myeloperoxidase (moderate risk)
fibrinogen (moderate risk)
symmetric dimethylarginine (intermediate risk)
asymmetric dimethylarginine/arginine Ratio (high risk)

These non-optimal results, going by the lab ranges, are rather outdated from 2013 and 2015 but stick in my mind.

If his prices hadn't soared around the time he published Plant Paradox it's possbile I'd still be seeing him for his take on my status.
ApoE 3/4 > Thanks in advance for any responses made to my posts.
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