niacin---nicotinomide

Alzheimer's, cardiovascular, and other chronic diseases; biomarkers, lifestyle, supplements, drugs, and health care.
Rshircliff
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 63
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2014 2:42 pm

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Rshircliff » Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:27 pm

Ah yes, Ski, you are so right! I do need to take everything in context and since I don't have a good grasp of my current numbers I am riding the fear train. I had to smile when you said
So if you have an increase in fasting BG is that the end of the world

That brought a smile to my face and the ever-so-elusive Clarity (yay) to my mind. For the past few weeks it has kind of felt that way. And that is not the way I want to feel. So thank you for pointing that out because you helped to guide me to the right perspective.
As I muddle through all this, I am becoming more mindful that fear keeps me from seeing the big picture. I will be getting labs next week so at least I will be more aware of which demon to fight.
I miss my glass of red wine...maybe that's what's wrong ;) -- how often do you have a glass?

User avatar
Ski
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:18 pm

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Ski » Thu Mar 26, 2015 1:46 pm

miss my glass of red wine...maybe that's what's wrong ;) -- how often do you have a glass?

Well, on average I probably have a half glass, 3-4 times a week. But I think Im probably the exception here in terms of alcohol consumption.

Tincup
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 1656
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: Front Range, CO

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Tincup » Sat May 02, 2015 8:39 pm

Had an interesting experience that I will chalk up most likely to niacin.

I've been taking 1 g/day of Slo-Niacin brand niacin before dinner in my evening supplements.

Today I skied non-stop for 7 hours, doing 34 laps, mostly off piste & on the steeps. On the way home, I decided to donate blood. I normally do this after I've worked out and don't have hard exercise planned for a few days (this avoids "hitting the wall" after 4-6 hours of exercise - I've had that experience the day after giving blood).

I donated. My pre-donation blood pressure was 108/64 (I don't take any medication). I never bother to eat or drink after donation, and have never had a problem. I got home and put stuff away and decided to take my evening supplements, including niacin. Also ate some nuts. Not too long afterward (15 minutes or so), I felt queasy & lightheaded with some sweats & chills. Finally got prone for a few minutes and felt better.

I later dawned on me, my reaction was most likely the niacin. Niacin dilates blood vessels. Though I did not take my blood pressure, I did feel my pulse while sitting. It felt like my pressure was reduced - pulse rate was normal & in good rhythm. This normalized when I was prone. My blood pressure was not elevated to begin with and then likely dropped. After a few minutes, I was completely back to normal. I'd never taken niacin after giving blood before.
Tincup
E3,E4

User avatar
pgf54
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 180
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2014 5:16 am
Location: Muchea, West Australia

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby pgf54 » Sat May 02, 2015 11:24 pm

I think from my experience the niacin caused some dehydration, so perhaps this also came into play with the depleted blood volume.?
I only took a very small dose 40mg and had pronounced flush which i was expecting, every hair in my beard pricked, as the redness moved down. That was ok but i still got a flush with 60mg and 100mg , well i awoke with my tongue almost stuck to the side of my mouth it was so dry, and i needed to get up in the night to try and drink...........
I increased fluids but it still had the same pronounced dehydrating effect on me , so i ceased it, as i didnt feel it could be doing my body any good, and all this at 100mg, whereas some people take huge doses.
Ps George i wonder if the person who gets your blood will have a niacin flush , lol
Don't wait for your ship to come in, row out to meet it.

Tincup
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 1656
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 2:57 pm
Location: Front Range, CO

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Tincup » Sun May 03, 2015 7:44 am

pgf54 wrote:I think from my experience the niacin caused some dehydration, so perhaps this also came into play with the depleted blood volume.?
I only took a very small dose 40mg and had pronounced flush which i was expecting, every hair in my beard pricked, as the redness moved down. That was ok but i still got a flush with 60mg and 100mg , well i awoke with my tongue almost stuck to the side of my mouth it was so dry, and i needed to get up in the night to try and drink...........
I increased fluids but it still had the same pronounced dehydrating effect on me , so i ceased it, as i didnt feel it could be doing my body any good, and all this at 100mg, whereas some people take huge doses.
Ps George i wonder if the person who gets your blood will have a niacin flush , lol


I really haven't experienced dehydration in ~4 months of my 1g/day dose.

From reading about it, the flush doesn't get larger with larger doses. It also diminishes with continued use, though will return if you start/stop the use.

Also, since niacin is a water soluble vitamin, it gets urinated out pretty quickly. My donation was ~23 hours after the previous dose, so unlikely hahaha.

This book author was one of the first investigators and used it treating cholesterol in patients for 45 years http://www.amazon.com/Cholesterol-Control-Without-William-Parsons/dp/0966256875. It is a good reference.
Tincup
E3,E4

User avatar
Teezer
Contributor
Contributor
Posts: 144
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 5:45 pm
Location: Pagosa Springs, Colorado

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Teezer » Fri Jul 10, 2015 2:28 pm

I get a weekly newsletter called Patrick Cox's Tech Digest, and the letter for this week gives some interesting back-story in the discovery of Nicotinic Acid (B3) and the effects of NAD+. You can read the whole thing, here:

Deep-Purple Mesoamerican Corn and Nutrition Puzzles

He links to several papers that may be of interest. This is the abstract of one of them:

Although baseline requirements for nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+) synthesis can be met either with dietary tryptophan or with less than 20 mg of daily niacin, which consists of nicotinic acid and/or nicotinamide, there is growing evidence that substantially greater rates of NAD+ synthesis may be beneficial to protect against neurological degeneration, Candida glabrata infection, and possibly to enhance reverse cholesterol transport. The distinct and tissue-specific biosynthetic and/or ligand activities of tryptophan, nicotinic acid, nicotinamide, and the newly identified NAD+ precursor, nicotinamide riboside, reviewed herein, are responsible for vitamin-specific effects and side effects. Because current data suggest that nicotinamide riboside may be the only vitamin precursor that supports neuronal NAD+ synthesis, we present prospects for human nicotinamide riboside supplementation and propose areas for future research.
It's weird how I'm constantly surprised by the passage of time when it's literally the most predictable thing in the universe. -- xkcd

User avatar
Julie G
Mod
Mod
Posts: 6601
Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2013 6:36 pm

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Julie G » Sat Jul 11, 2015 7:18 pm

Really GREAT link, Teezer. Interestingly, nicotinamide is also what Dr. Gundry recommends for E4 carriers- specifically for brain health. Funny how much those "primitive" Native Americans knew ;)

This referenced paper (brand new) looks really good. I'd love to see full-text if anyone can get it. It delves into the role that declining levels of NAD+ play in accelerated aging—specifically focusing on nicotinamide riboside as a means of reversing that decline. This might be especially important for E4 carriers given our reduction in mitochondrial energy. That Dr. Gundry MAY be onto something...

NAD+ Metabolism and the Control of Energy Homeostasis: A Balancing Act between Mitochondria and the Nucleus
http://www.cell.com/cell-metabolism/abs ... %2900266-1

User avatar
Stavia
Mod
Mod
Posts: 4536
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:47 pm
Location: Middle Earth

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Stavia » Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:01 pm

Julie its too big. I'll email it to you

User avatar
Stavia
Mod
Mod
Posts: 4536
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:47 pm
Location: Middle Earth

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Stavia » Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:01 pm

Stavia wrote:Julie its too big. I'll email it to you


here it is smaller, thanks to George <3
nad comp.pdf

Moderator note - I deleted the attached paper (doi:10.1016/j.cmet.2015.05.023) because our copyright infringement policy prohibits it. Members in jurisdictions for which access to Sci-Hub is legal may want to search for the paper there.

User avatar
Julie G
Mod
Mod
Posts: 6601
Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2013 6:36 pm

Re: niacin---nicotinomide

Postby Julie G » Sun Jul 12, 2015 5:42 pm

Huge thanks to you both. It's an intimidating beast. Who needs Kanji? :D


Return to “Prevention and Treatment”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: cathryn and 13 guests