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Fish Oil

Alzheimer's, cardiovascular, and other chronic diseases; biomarkers, lifestyle, supplements, drugs, and health care.
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Juliegee
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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Juliegee » Fri May 02, 2014 10:20 am

Perhaps more evidence that DHA is neuroprotective in this new paper exploring how DHA depletion can impair recovery from TBI: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24475126

It reminded me of this story reported on CNN that Circular shared previously: http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/18/health/fi ... ?hpt=hp_c2

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Juliegee » Fri May 02, 2014 11:25 am

Are the waters murky enough yet? Here's a brand new paper that supports Peskin's position, finding fish intake correlates with worsened cognitive performance :?

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24353345

EDIT: interesting that this study looked at EPA. Researchers contend that DHA may be the more important Omega 3 for neuroprotection. Perhaps THAT's what accounts for some of the variability.

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Juliegee » Sun May 04, 2014 7:51 pm

And, courtesy of Spunky (from another thread) here's another, slightly older, paper by Peskin:
http://www.brianpeskin.com/BP.com/publi ... matory.pdf

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby MarcR » Wed May 07, 2014 8:46 pm

A quick search for "parent essential oils" will turn up multiple ways to purchase expensive bottles of Peskin's proprietary blend of exotic-sounding oils - evening primrose, flax, pumpkin, etc. The two scientifically-styled papers that have been linked here focus lots of energy on the "fish oil is poison - replace with parent essential oils" theme but little on positive evidence for PEO supplementation and none at all on the optimal mix of PEOs.

Coupled with the Texas Consumer Protection Division's judgement against him, I continue to be suspicious of everything he says. I think a well-enforced truth in labeling law would require products using his proprietary blend to disclose one more oil - 99% snake!

After spending a lot of time with the references in the latest linked article, I don't see any support for his position that the marine oil in fish is effectively poisonous. Has anyone found evidence (absent the Peskin taint) of extreme harm caused by consuming oily fish?
(Formerly merouleau)

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby SpunkyPup » Thu May 08, 2014 9:27 am

ok here we go again.. this I posted sometime ago is one of the better reviews..see refer


Omega-3s, ApoE Genotype and Cognitive Decline

by Lara Pizzorno, MDiv, MA, LMT
Abstract

The most recent statistics indicate that dietary intake of omega-3 PUFA is insufficient in >95% of Americans. Deficits in omega-3s have been shown to contribute to inflammatory signaling, apoptosis, and neuronal dysfunction in all cause dementia, including Alzheimer's disease. DHA (22:6[n-3]), specifically, is a critical contributor to cell structure and function in the nervous system, and a recently identified DHA-derived messenger, neuroprotecting D1 (NPD1) has been found to regulate brain cell survival and to promote non-amyloidogenic processing of amyloid precursor protein, thus protecting against Alzheimer's disease by inhibiting formation of β-amyloid. Studies utilizing omega-3 supplementation to improve cognitive function in elders, however, have had mixed outcomes, an inconsistency which newly published research indicates is related to ApoE genotype. ApoE ε4 carriers have not been able to benefit from omega-3s. This article discusses why and what can be done to enable carriers of the ApoeE ε4 allele to receive the neuroprotective benefits of omega-3s.

http://www.lmreview.com/articles/view/o ... e-decline/

Here is the article archives

http://www.lmreview.com/articles/catego ... -research/

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Juliegee » Thu May 08, 2014 10:30 am

Thanks for re-posting the Pizzorno paper, Spunky. It's posted elsewhere on the site, but not on this thread :!:

Merouleau, I hear you, my friend. That certainly gives the appearance of impropriety... But, many of these scientists and physicians do the same from the Deepak/Chopra team to Perlmutter. The fact that Peskin sells supplements IS suspect, but I'm still trying to hear the message.

I, too, wish those, who agree with Peskin; would chime in here. Read the thread from the beginning. Others argue his position eloquently.

The scientists with http://www.CognitiveVitality.org team reviewed all of the data & concluded that YES, fish oil is likely to be neuro-protective; NOT for E4s. Sigh. So, what are we 4/4s to do? Strategy, after strategy (with the exception of physical exercise!!!) is beneficial to non-E4 carriers, but not for us.

I'm just speaking for myself here, but I'm reading all that I can to understand how ApoE4 alters lipid homeostasis and increases oxidative stress and trying to incorporate that with my understanding of how fish oil provides neuro-cognitive protection. I'm hoping that by maintaining a diet rich in both plant & animal N-3s (along with 900 mg DHA) chock-full of dietary (and supplemental) antioxidants, I MAY be able to derive the same benefit as non E-4 carriers. I'm guessing the previous E4 studies didn't include folks like you and I- eating so pristinely to overcome the ApoE4 obstacles.

E4 Mice, eating their version of Souvenaid (combo of N-3 & antioxidants), DO show benefit. I have to review the literature, but I think a few E4 folks using Souvenaid as well. Then there's lipidologist Thomas Dayspring, upon being asked dietary advice for ∈4s, on a podcast with Jimmy Moore. He suggested that a ketogenic diet might ward off Alzheimer’s. He then goes on to recommend
Drown yourself in omega-3 fatty acids” if you carry an ∈4

Definitive evidence for protection from N-3s is lacking for our population, but it doesn't mean we can't try :roll: I've gone back and forth on this... and probably will again. In the meantime, let's stay on top of the most current research so we can chose educated strategies for ourselves.

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby SpunkyPup » Thu May 08, 2014 8:21 pm

I take >1.2g of epa/dha

at DrDavis site trackyourplaque.com it is well known that it can cause problems and there is a level above where I supplement that for some E4's it is true but some E3/4 can tolerate 6g altho they are taking many other things, high fish oil can reduce Lp(a). There are other sources I could dig up to but it a lot of working to assess the papers. It is also referred to by lipid testing companies like Berkley Labs etc. but some is not on their site and I can't find it but I have the studies on file on my desktop somewhere.
also if you remember kirkopat an E3/4 he also had a problem with fish oil and dr goldstritch knows of the problem and I quoted him many times too, just see his interview as he is an E3/4 and a cardiologist too.

there are some studies and graphes which show a doughnut hole affect of no benefit of fish oil from 2g to 4g but I would have to go look for them and post them.

Peskin writing is mixed with all kinds of flaws and is difficult to find where his false assumptions are without a lot of time figuring it out and he is known to twist the facts to his likings which is also done with DrP and even some other researchers. I'm no biochemist so it is really difficult and time consuming. Once you find this out yourself after wasting time figuring it out you realize not much of anything they say is worth noting as it is built on false premises.

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Kathleen1 » Thu May 08, 2014 9:18 pm

OK, after reading this long thread, I, an E3/E4, take a teaspoon of Carlson's Norwegian cod-liver oil(DHA 500mg, EPA 400mg) a couple of days during the week, when I take a New Chapter Tumeric Force (22mg curcuminoids & some other stuff), having been told to take it fasting with the fish oil, but mostly just eat the tuna and salmon a couple days per week. Whole foods over the supplements until we figure this out.

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby MarcR » Sat May 10, 2014 11:02 am

The Pizzorno paper is interesting, and many of its claims seem plausible. Without reading each of the references - so much work! - I come away with the following:

1. In general, E4 carriers do not benefit from consuming fatty fish.
2. Physically active E4 carriers who consume traditional non-processed foods thrive.
3. The hypothesis that the efficacy of fatty fish consumption in E4s depends on other diet and exercise factors is plausible.

The promotion of the low-fat diet attribute is not well supported as she did not differentiate between low- and high-fat traditional non-processed food diets.

My bottom line hasn't changed, but I feel more confident about it. :-) I'm going to continue to consume a can of water-packed brisling sardines 2-3 times a week. I'm undecided about continuing to supplement 1g/day and may quit once my current supply runs out.

Julie, thanks for the detailed commentary and references. I'm beginning to take a look at Dayspring's ideas.
(Formerly merouleau)

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Re: Fish Oil

Postby Juliegee » Sat May 31, 2014 7:33 pm

Here's a new study that found higher levels of serum Omega 3s were correlated with larger total brain and hippocampal volumes: https://www.neurology.org/content/82/5/ ... 139d39084f

Conclusion: A higher omega-3 index was correlated with larger total normal brain volume and hippocampal volume in postmenopausal women measured 8 years later. While normal aging results in overall brain atrophy, lower omega-3 index may signal increased risk of hippocampal atrophy. Future studies should examine whether maintaining higher RBC EPA + DHA levels slows the rate of hippocampal or overall brain atrophy.


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