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MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Insights and discussion from the cutting edge with reference to journal articles and other research papers.
david lerner
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MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby david lerner » Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:11 pm

Hi,
Has anyone heard of this as a useful means to enhance HDL levels? Does anyone know if Gundry advocates this?

Thanks!
David

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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby Tincup » Wed Mar 29, 2017 7:10 am

david lerner wrote:Has anyone heard of this as a useful means to enhance HDL levels? Does anyone know if Gundry advocates this?


Gundry recently posted that he is "suspicious" about MCT oil for E4's. He has observed coconut oil increase sdLDL in E4's. Some of his E4 patients don't have this sdLDL increase and use MCT's. He also said he'll have more to say about MCT's in his new book which releases on April 25. I'm not aware about him mentioning MCT's and HDL levels.
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Julie G
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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby Julie G » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:09 am

George, can you give us more information? Dr. Gundry has probably collected the most evidence on this of anyone in the world given his recommendations and subsequent data collections. Previously, he had recommended capryllic acid, the C8 version of MCT for E4s. Is he backing off of that as well?

Given our population's reduced cerebral utilization of glucose for fuel, we have lots of hints that both coconut oil and MCT can be helpful especially for folks who are experiencing insulin resistance which will further deteriorate cerebral glucose uptake. Dr. Bredesen is currently recommending coconut oil and MCT for his patients during the immediate crisis and until insulin resistance can be resolved. Once cognition and glycemic markers improve, he's recommending that E4 carriers switch to MUFAs and PUFAs (avocados, nuts, seeds, olives, high polyphenol EVOO, fatty fish, etc.) to maintain ketosis. Of course, his recommendations specify that the low glycemic/low carb diet should be applied to a protocol that includes fasting, exercise and multiple other strategies.

Like everyone, I'm beyond frustrated given the billions of dollars that have been spent on "curing" Alzheimer's that basic research examining how E4 carriers respond to coconut oil and MCT, in term of cardiovascular disease, hasn't been formally explored in any meaningful way.

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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby Tincup » Wed Mar 29, 2017 9:58 am

Juliegee wrote:George, can you give us more information? Dr. Gundry has probably collected the most evidence on this of anyone in the world given his recommendations and subsequent data collections. Previously, he had recommended capryllic acid, the C8 version of MCT for E4s. Is he backing off of that as well?


From this FB post, those who are members of that group can access the post directly. For others:

Question: "I sat in on my daughters appointment a few weeks ago. At my last appt with him he said no coconut oil. At the end of this visit I asked Dr G if 4/4s could have MCT oil hoping that whatever was in coconut oil that is not good for 4/4 was not in the MCT oil. He said - well, it's coconut, isn't it. So I assume no MCT oil. Because it wasn't really my appt I did not ask any follow up questions but I am wondering - does this mean no coconut flour, coco ghee, coco milk, coco cream, coco condensed milk, etc?"

From another patient: "I know that he had been vacillating about the coconut oil for 4's because some of us have elevation in sdLdl's when using it. Last week he didn't mention anything to us about not using MCT oil. Previously he said it was neutral. I don't think that it means you can't have coconut products, but it wouldn't hurt to send an email for clarification. Now my curiosity is peaked! We haven't shown elevated levels so maybe that is the difference and we use MCT daily."

Answer - Steven Gundry: "Just watch my YouTube video on Apo E 4. I am still suspicious of coconut oil for 4's. Also suspicious of MCT oil, but as you will see in the new book, MCT may behave differently. Coconut flour is totally different in behavior. Dr G" Assume he means the AHS16 presentation.

So my take would be the verdict is not yet in and if you use it and you test OK on sdLDL-C, then fine, otherwise no. Though C-8 may be viable as it does act differently & that may be what he talks about in his book.

As an aside, I'm a guinea pig for Marty Kendall's Nutrient Optimizer program. As such I'm doing a detailed food diary for 14 days, weighing most everything on a gram scale. I will post here when I get the results. In any case, I've sampled a few morning serum ketone levels the evening after my daily meal. Eating my normal large bowl of salad, ketones were at 1.8 mmol/L. Last night we had yucca fries, which is a resistive starch and fairly carby, by ketone level was still 1.0. So I'm maintaining a reasonable ketone level even with a fair amount of carb intake. To use Marty's program, I first have to input everything into Cronometer then export to a csv file. I'll be interested to see what the level of carbs/fiber (fibre) turn out to be.
Last edited by Tincup on Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby apod » Wed Mar 29, 2017 10:13 am

GeorgeN wrote:From another patient: "I know that he had been vacillating about the coconut oil for 4's because some of us have elevation in sdLdl's when using it. Last week he didn't mention anything to us about not using MCT oil. Previously he said it was neutral. I don't think that it means you can't have coconut products, but it wouldn't hurt to send an email for clarification. Now my curiosity is peaked! We haven't shown elevated levels so maybe that is the difference and we use MCT daily."

I'm very curious about this as well! I might go ahead and finally run my C8 MCT oil experiment. I wonder if 4 weeks of 2TBS/d of caprylic acid would be enough to see a result on an advanced lipid test?

Although, I'm still left wondering if it would be better in theory to combine the MCT Ketones with a carb-induced insulin spike (which is fairly unnatural), where the MCT does seem to increase insulin production / glucose disposal, increase glutathione, and prevent methylglyoxal production... or, if it makes more sense to LCHF the MCT into deep ketosis... Hmm.

I've heard good things about omega-7 boosting HDL.

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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby Robin2038 » Thu Mar 30, 2017 5:15 pm

I added quest MCT oil powder to my coffee nearly every day (a scoop) and continued using half and half for about four months and my NMR was nearly Identical (meaning good!) to my first one 6 months ago. I also eat a plain full fat yogurt nearly daily and use butter. I am apoe 3/4 with type A pattern and my HDL rose a bit but that's it. I was expecting to have to cut out the MCT oil so I'm happy I can keep it. I too lost too much weight on a fairly low carb but not Keto diet so the MCT is helpful along with extra nuts.

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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby Tincup » Thu Mar 30, 2017 5:30 pm

Robin2038 wrote:I added quest MCT oil powder to my coffee nearly every day (a scoop) and continued using half and half for about four months and my NMR was nearly Identical (meaning good!) to my first one 6 months ago. I also eat a plain full fat yogurt nearly daily and use butter. I am apoe 3/4 with type A pattern and my HDL rose a bit but that's it. I was expecting to have to cut out the MCT oil so I'm happy I can keep it. I too lost too much weight on a fairly low carb but not Keto diet so the MCT is helpful along with extra nuts.


Gundry always tells us to "get our numbers in line and then see what we can get away with."

There is a lot of individual variability.
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Re: MCT oil to boost HDL levels

Postby ajc » Sun Apr 02, 2017 2:53 am

Re caprylic acid its used as a treatment for bacterial overgrowths so lpktentially affects commensels as well. Not something we need an a daily basis

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