Why does Dr. Gundry say no crossfit for apoe4?

[Jan]

I've often seen rebounding reported as very good for stimulating the lymphatic system.

[Tincup]

"Another potential result of excess intense exercise is Atrial fibrillation (AFib). AFib is an abnormal or rapid heart rate, a common but serious arrhythmia. Two groups are at high risk for AFib: Obese, sedentary people, and thin, active people who over exercise."

OK that is of interest to me, my dad has ran marathons all his life and presumably has the 4 gene as I do (well likely, anyway) and has now developed atrial fibrillation. He still runs though, and is getting treatment (blood thinners, had a cardioversion which helped a little) but maybe something to be aware of for me in the future.

At present I enjoy swimming and walking, yoga and simple weights but in a calming way not stressy, maybe will keep it that way and possibly do a little bit HIIT but nothing too stressful. Thanks.

I presented with afib 13 years ago at age 49 because of chronic fitness. I wasn't particularly thin, but I was fit and participated in high altitude races (for example, starting at 6,300' ending at 14,100' over 13 1/3 miles). I had remained fit and active all my life. This progressed to a 2.5 month episode that started after the first 2 months. After my EP (electrophysiologist) wanted to leave me in afib, I created a remission program that he approved. It involved chemical cardioversion with the drug flecainide, magnesium to bowel tolerance (currently around 1.5 to 2 g/day, has been up to 5.5 g/day), detraining and a prescription for flecainide to be used on demand if the remission failed. I've been doing this for 13 years successfully. Also learned excess calcium from diet or supplements is a bad actor for my afib, so limit that to 600 mg/day from diet. My training now does not include any cardio. I do HIIT, strength, bodyweight, alpine skiing and rock climbing. When I detrained, I started putting on weight. I'd played US football in college and never dropped that weight. I went keto in 2009 and dropped from 215 into the 170's and maintain that. For 2 1/2 years I've eaten in a 2 hour window and for 6 months have fasted five consecutive days out of every 14. I always exercise (or play) fasted, including on the multiday fasts. I've been out of rhythm 4 times in the last 4 years. I'm 62, have a DEXA scan t score of 0 (means bone density of a 30 year old male) and my body fat on my limbs & torso is in 1st percentile for my age.

As the EP told me about cardiversions - I can do that for you, but how am I going to keep you in rhythm? That's when I created my own program.

My Troponin-I on my Gundry tests is excellent. I had a long conversation with my running friend, Dr. Mark Cucuzzella about cardio. Mark trains according to Dr. Phil Maffetone's program (max training heart rate 180-age) and tells me he always wants to feel better after a run, not worn out. See here..

[Orangeblossom]

Thanks Tincup. I'm glad to hear things are going well for you. Yes my dad had a cardioversion but as you say it only seems to work for a while. My dad is still running so seems OK, I have tried to mention some ideas to him so he may do some of them but we'll see.

[NancyM]

Thank you Theresa and Tincup for the great information you’ve presented in this thread. I began my health journey in 2014 after my dad’s death from AD. My parents lived with us for Dad’s last 5 years and my own health really went down the tubes while caring for him and my mom who was blind and had lots of health issues, among them Afib. I began running in 2015 at the age of 55 and gradually worked my way up to running the Chicago Marathon last month. I pretty much hate running. I’m slow and I’m winded the whole time I’m running, but I’ve done it for the health benefits as well as for the sense of accomplishment in setting and achieving a goal. Since the marathon I’ve been pretty much sticking to power walking instead of running and, after reading your comments and the links you’ve provided, and after going back to look at my heart rate stats for my runs versus my walks, I realize walking is way better for me. Yay! I know I feel a lot better after walking a few miles than I did after running the marathon! I’m so grateful for this forum and all the incredible information on it.

[Tincup]

Thank you Theresa and Tincup for the great information you’ve presented in this thread. I began my health journey in 2014 after my dad’s death from AD. My parents lived with us for Dad’s last 5 years and my own health really went down the tubes while caring for him and my mom who was blind and had lots of health issues, among them Afib. I began running in 2015 at the age of 55 and gradually worked my way up to running the Chicago Marathon last month. I pretty much hate running. I’m slow and I’m winded the whole time I’m running, but I’ve done it for the health benefits as well as for the sense of accomplishment in setting and achieving a goal. Since the marathon I’ve been pretty much sticking to power walking instead of running and, after reading your comments and the links you’ve provided, and after going back to look at my heart rate stats for my runs versus my walks, I realize walking is way better for me. Yay! I know I feel a lot better after walking a few miles than I did after running the marathon! I’m so grateful for this forum and all the incredible information on it.

In his first book, Diet Evolution, Dr. Gundry supports walking, sprinting & strength training, "My advice: If you run or walk long, go slow; if you run or walk short, go fast. " He is a fan of high intensity, just not overdoing it. He is not a fan of long distance running. He and I talked about "super slow to failure" workouts. He likes those, too.

Here is a short video by the doc on the topic.

[LanceS]

First time I had seen this mentioned elsewhere:

Not sure it says much, but so many folks I have talked to haven't even heart of this before.

http://www.acc.org/latest-in-cardiology ... nce-sports

The life of an E4, trodding new ground with genes allowing us to do it barefoot. Hopefully within a few years we'll get some common sense guidelines for when enough is enough. Cheers all.

[Tincup]

First time I had seen this mentioned elsewhere:
http://www.acc.org/latest-in-cardiology ... nce-sports
The life of an E4, trodding new ground with genes allowing us to do it barefoot. Hopefully within a few years we'll get some common sense guidelines for when enough is enough. Cheers all.

Some studies reported an increased incidence of atrial fibrillation or arrhythmogenic right ventricular cardiomyopathy among endurance athletes

The afib from endurance activity is me. Diagnosed 13.5 years ago after a lifetime of endurance activities. Fortunately by detraining from endurance activities (though remaining very active and fit - bodyweight training & HIIT) I've been able to keep its impact on me very low.

[LanceS]

Thanks Tincup. I was a little lazy with my original post, trying to get it done and move onto something else. Life has a way of keeping us on our toes, eh?!

I meant to explain that the article does show that there is an innocuous reason for some troponin tests. For me, I have run the bell on a troponin test in the past and it has pretty much freaked me out. After getting a variety of cardiac workups I feel better that my troponin test was just the result of either overdoing it or the cytoplasmic source of troponin. So I guess I have concluded I shouldn't go into "deep water" with any squat routines, but as long as I don't go nuts, I can have a normal squat / other intense workout.

The curves also present a way to assess whether it is a dangerous troponin response. 72 hours seems to be where a cytoplasmic response should be pretty much gone, but a less innocuous response would still be there. So I plan to workout 72 hours away from a draw time, and hopefully that will start to tell me something about the danger inherent in my workouts.

Cheers, Happy New Year all!

[Kylie]

Oh no! I’m 4/4, and have taken up long distance running over the last 6 months. I’m training for a half marathon at the moment (I can’t say I’m enjoying the training, but I like how I feel when it’s done!). My father has early onset Alzheimer’s, and my mum has AFib. I do have strange palpitations often, but have delayed seeing the doc in case I’m sick (?).

I also have a long held dream of doing thru hikes on 1000km+ trails.

I don’t want to hear this information, I feel like sticking my fingers in my ears and saying la la la.

I know it’s up to me to decide, but does this mean I should stop training, and give up my plans for the hikes?

[Stavia]

Well.... I've started crossfit a couple months ago. My husband and I go to a trainer we have known for 30 years and trust, he is very very careful about safety and preventing injury. There are many people our age who attend, the community is very mixed. I am finding it a wonderful strength builder. Also aerobic conditioning and flexibility. And the trainer won't let us go hard enough to cause cardiovascular damage plus I'm not stupid - I work at a capacity that would be equivalent to how I could run at a moderate pace for maybe 20 mins, and the rest is strength. I do not believe that my crossfit is anything other than a hugely positive part of my excercise.

Context.

Nuance.

Very little in our world is back and white.

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